Senate Proceeding 03-31-09 on Mar 31st, 2009 :: 1:40:00 to 2:00:00
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1:39:52 to 1:40:12( Edit History Discussion )

Lamar Alexander: with that, i thank the chair, and i would yield back the remaing time that we've been allotted on this and s recognition, i would suggest the absence -- the presiding officer: the

1:39:55 to 1:48:30( Edit History Discussion )
Speech By: Lamar Alexander

1:40:13 to 1:40:33( Edit History Discussion )

Lamar Alexander: senator from mr. alexander: thank you, mr. president. i was just making my entrance. mr. president, i ask unanimous consent to set aside t pending amendment. the presiding officer: is there objection? without objection. mr. alexander: mr. president, i call up amendment number 747 and ask

1:40:34 to 1:40:55( Edit History Discussion )

Lamar Alexander: consideration. the pres clerk will report the a the clerk: the senator from tennessee, mr. a alexander -- mr. alexander: mr. preside, i ask unanimous consent to dispense with f the amendment. the presiding officer: without objection. mr. alexander: thank you, mr. president. i see the senator from new hampshire is here and the senator from arizona, the assistant republican leader,

1:40:56 to 1:41:17( Edit History Discussion )

Lamar Alexander: will be here in a few minutes, i believe. senator gregg a little earlier offered an amendment which essentially would say that the debt under president obama's budget cou all the debt that has been accumulated by all the presidents since george washington. that's one way of american people and to the

1:41:18 to 1:41:39( Edit History Discussion )

Lamar Alexander: senate that the debt that is proposed by these budgets is so staggeringly high that we need to find some way to put a limit on it. i'm offering, with this amendment, another way to put some limit on it. i call it a runaway debt point of order.

1:41:40 to 1:42:01( Edit History Discussion )

Lamar Alexander: this is not a letting the horse get out of the barn. this recognizes that the horse is already out of the barn and we're trying to put a fence around him before he gets into the next county or even into the next country. what this amendment would dos create a new point of order against considering any budget

1:42:02 to 1:42:24( Edit History Discussion )

Lamar Alexander: resolution that estimates gross federal debt, our total debt, total amount of obligations exceeding 90% of gross domestic product in any year covered by the budget. put that in a little plainer english, what it means is the senate would be forced to come up with 60 votes if the public

1:42:25 to 1:42:45( Edit History Discussion )

Lamar Alexander: debt in any year grows beyond 90% of the estimated gross domestic product. the gross domestic product, of course, is what all of us produce in the united states every year. and despite the fact we're in an economic slowdown, we are a very privileged country. we'renly about 5% of the people, those of us who live in

1:42:46 to 1:43:07( Edit History Discussion )

Lamar Alexander: the united states, but year in and year out we produce about $1 out of every $4 of wealth produced in the world, 22%, 23%, 24%, 26% of all the wealth produced each year in the world is produced in the united states for distribution among primarily

1:43:08 to 1:43:30( Edit History Discussion )

Lamar Alexander: the 5% of us who live here. so we're a very privileged country. and this says that if we intend in any year to increase the debt above 90% of all of that in any year, that 60 of us have got to agree with that. now, when was the last time the united states, to try to put

1:43:31 to 1:43:51( Edit History Discussion )

Lamar Alexander: 90% into some sort of -- in some sort of perspective, when was the last time that we had an annual national -- that we had a debt, a national debt that exceed 90% of the gross domestic product? it was when we had world war ii,

1:43:52 to 1:44:12( Edit History Discussion )

Lamar Alexander: as we were coming out of world war ii. of course, during that time it didn't matter what we spent. didn't matter what we taxed. we were in a fight for our lives, and we did whatever we could think of to do, spent whatever we could think of to spend, ran up any debt we needed to to win the war. and we did win that war.

1:44:13 to 1:44:37( Edit History Discussion )

Lamar Alexander: and so right after world war ii, our debt, are our national debt, was about 90% of the annual gross domestic product of the united states. more recently, it's been about 40%. about 40%. but here is what happens now. the senator from new hampshire

1:44:38 to 1:44:59( Edit History Discussion )

Lamar Alexander: went into this to some degree. we talked about deficits. let me make a little distinction between deficits and debt. deficits are each yea addition to the debt. and we talked about the fact that that's growing up this year and next year during the recession. we understand that that is necessary to some degree.

1:45:00 to 1:45:20( Edit History Discussion )

Lamar Alexander: but then it comes back down to out 4% of gross domestic product, and it stays at about 4% of gross domestic product. that's the obama budget. that's the conrad budget, which as the budget director for president obama says is about

1:45:21 to 1:45:42( Edit History Discussion )

Lamar Alexander: 90%, 98% of the obama budget. but it's a level of deficit as compared with g.d.p. that is worse than the following countries: guatamala, the philippines, aruba, cuba, nigeria. that's the level of annual deficit. but this amendment seeks to talk about the debt.

1:45:43 to 1:46:03( Edit History Discussion )

Lamar Alexander: for example, the president's proposal is to double the debt almost in five years and to triple it in almost ten years. so we start out with about 40% of gross domestic product, but by 2014 we're at 66.5% of

1:46:04 to 1:46:24( Edit History Discussion )

Lamar Alexander: domestic product under senator conrad's budget. t president obama's ten-year budget, which is a picture of america's future in the same way grade class would be a picture of a community's future ten years the president actually presented a very honest picture of our

1:46:25 to 1:46:46( Edit History Discussion )

Lamar Alexander: future as he sees and i respect him greatly for that. i just don't like the picture that he's presented, because that picture, as i mentioned, doubles the debt in five years and nearly triples it in ten years. so we go from about 40% of gross domestic product to 71% of gross

1:46:47 to 1:47:09( Edit History Discussion )

Lamar Alexander: domestic product. under president bush -- and we hear a lot of talking about president bush. i was listening to the radio yesterday morning. they said how can you republicans -- how can you republicans be talking about debt when under president bush you ran up the debt? true. true. gives us a chance to deal with that, because he points out that

1:47:10 to 1:47:31( Edit History Discussion )

Lamar Alexander: president obama would increase the debt more not just than president bush, but than all the presidents put together going back to george washington. that's a very sobering so president bush was -- may have made some mistakes, but he was not judged on whether he caused hurricane

1:47:32 to 1:47:52( Edit History Discussion )

Lamar Alexander: he was judged on how he reacted to it. president obama certainly didn't create the economic mess we're in. he won't be judged by that. but he will be judged and the majority parity will be kwrupblg -- majority party will be judged by how well they react to that. we don't believe that doubling the debt and tripling theebt is a way to grow the economy and

1:47:53 to 1:48:14( Edit History Discussion )

Lamar Alexander: restore good jobs. i see the senator from new hampshire here, and i would like to 90% of this and 20% of that and $1 trillion of this, all of that makes the case, but it's hard to fathom.

1:48:15 to 1:48:31( Edit History Discussion )

Lamar Alexander: i would ask through the chair to the senator from new hampshire, how would you put in, in terms that the average family can deal with what it means to double the debt in five years and nearly triple it in ten years as the

1:48:32 to 1:48:52( Edit History Discussion )

Judd Gregg: president's budget would mr. gregg: mr. president, if the senator would yield for purposes of a question, i'll try to make it the presiding officer: the senator from new hampshire. mr. gregg: first off, i congratulate the senator for his amendment because it is a serious amendment addressing what i consider to be the mt rious problem with the president's b that the amount of debt that's

1:48:35 to 1:49:50( Edit History Discussion )
Speech By: Judd Gregg

1:48:53 to 1:49:13( Edit History Discussion )

Judd Gregg: being put on the books by this budget as a result of incredible expansion of the size of the government and the spending of the government is going to put us in a situation whereas the senator noted, we will probably not be able to s payment of that debt or we will be forced into a position like some of the countries that he

1:49:14 to 1:49:36( Edit History Discussion )

Judd Gregg: mentioned, have gone which is serious inflation or an inability to borrow money because people worry about the ability to be concned ab of the dollar. it's hard, i think, and inappropriate for one generation to put that much debt on the back of another generation.

1:49:37 to 1:49:53( Edit History Discussion )

Judd Gregg: and so what the senator is proposing is that not that you can't pass the budget, but that when you do pass the budget that raises the public debt, the gross debt in this case, up to

1:49:54 to 1:50:15( Edit History Discussion )

Lamar Alexander: like cuba and anguila -- what were the other countries? mr. alexander: guatamala, the philippines, aruba. mr. president, i ask unanimous consent that the senator from new hampshire and i be allowed to engage in colloquy during the remaining minutes that we have. the presiding officer: without objection. mr. alexander: thank you. guatamala, the philippines, aruba, cuba, nigeria are countries that have an annual

1:49:55 to 1:50:45( Edit History Discussion )
Speech By: Lamar Alexander

1:50:16 to 1:50:36( Edit History Discussion )

Lamar Alexander: deficit level higher than -- or lower than we will have. mr. gregg: and the debt level too, i suspect. in fact, we could not get into the european union at the debt level of 90% of g.d.p. they would not even allow us in. mr. alexander: lots of times members of congress sort of make fun of europe, make tpupbs of france and say -- make fun of

1:50:37 to 1:50:46( Edit History Discussion )

Lamar Alexander: france and say that's french. we don't want to be french. it's embarrassing to say the situation exists that if the united states were applying to be a member of the european

1:50:47 to 1:51:09( Edit History Discussion )

Judd Gregg: union, our annual deficit level would be too high to be admitted. we would be unqualified during the e to be admitted if we were to choose to do mr. gregg: that is correct as a result of this budget being put forward by the president because the budget proposes a dramatic expansion in spending. it takes the spending of the federal government up to levels we have not seen since world war ii.

1:50:50 to 1:51:35( Edit History Discussion )
Speech By: Judd Gregg

1:51:10 to 1:51:30( Edit History Discussion )

Judd Gregg: the senator asks how does this, these huge numbers which nobody can understand $1 trillion, how does that translate into the house, how does that translate to the person who lives on main street? basically it means that at the end of this budget, every household in america will have an obligation relative to the federal debt that's owed of $133,000.

1:51:31 to 1:51:35( Edit History Discussion )

Judd Gregg: that's probably lot of mortgages that th have. not only do you have your mortgage on your house, but

1:51:36 to 1:51:56( Edit History Discussion )

Lamar Alexander: you're going to have a federal debt which you are responsible for of $10,000 -- of $130,000. the service on that debt, in other words the interest cost to pay for that debt will be a year. mr. alexaer: let me ask the senator from new hampshire, 30

1:51:40 to 1:51:55( Edit History Discussion )
Speech By: Lamar Alexander

1:51:57 to 1:52:17( Edit History Discussion )

Judd Gregg: years ago, i guess -- well, who's the mortgage holder on that debt? mr. gregg: china, regrettably. china is the primary mortgage holder, although there are other nations which hold our debt. russia. russia holds a lot of our debt. middle eastern countries, the oil-producing saudi arabia.

1:52:00 to 1:54:05( Edit History Discussion )
Speech By: Judd Gregg

1:52:18 to 1:52:39( Edit History Discussion )

Judd Gregg: obviously america also of the debt. the countries outside our nation, regrettably, have raised their level of ownership of our debt. it's actually good for us because we have some people who have been willing to borrow, we've been able to lend to, people who have been willing to lend us money and we borrowed from them. primarily china and russia and

1:52:40 to 1:53:02( Edit History Discussion )

Judd Gregg: other countries in the middle east have been lending us money. and so when we pay back this set that will be run up so dramatically. doubled in five years an tripled in 10 -- and tripled by thisudget we're basically going to be sending money -- hard-earned money from americans

1:53:03 to 1:53:23( Edit History Discussion )

Judd Gregg: to these other nations. mr. alexander: and the mortgage holders around the world, china, the middle east, and other countries, worry is getting too high, i suppose what they do is simply stop buying o to pay them more, pay a higher interest rate for our mortgage debt.

1:53:24 to 1:53:44( Edit History Discussion )

Judd Gregg: mr. gregg: that's absolutely right. that comes out of every american's ability to have a better life here. america will have to taxes and won't have as much discretionary spending to buy a house, on to college and buying a car an doing things that americans like to do in order to enjoy a good life.

1:53:45 to 1:54:09( Edit History Discussion )

Judd Gregg: so much of the income of america will have to pour into the debt that will be run up budget we'r we're looking at now. by the te we get to -- through the 10-year perio that has been proposed in this budget, the amount of money that we as a nation will pay in interest, just interest on the federal

1:54:10 to 1:54:30( Edit History Discussion )

Lamar Alexander: debt, will be over $800 billion. almost $1 trillion. that is interest annually. that will be more money than we pay -- than we spend on defending america on our national defense. recollectiomr. alexander: and we have been worrying about sending money overseas to buy oil. we would be sending half of that

1:54:10 to 1:55:19( Edit History Discussion )
Speech By: Lamar Alexander

1:54:31 to 1:54:52( Edit History Discussion )

Lamar Alexander: money overseas to pay interest on the debt. the senator from new hampshire was governor of new hampshire, just as i was governor of tennessee, we had friendly competition about which had the most conservative fiscal policies. of course tennessee did. but one thing that we always tried to do was keep our debt low. because that meant that we had

1:54:53 to 1:55:13( Edit History Discussion )

Lamar Alexander: more money for schools and more money for state parks and more money for hospitals. and what happens when we debt so hig paying $800 billion in interest, that's -- i believe that's 10 times more than the federal government spends on education each year and 10 times more than the federal government spends on transportation each year.

1:55:14 to 1:55:20( Edit History Discussion )

Lamar Alexander: so we' taking away the men that we would invest to make

1:55:20 to 1:56:20( Edit History Discussion )
Speech By: Judd Gregg

1:55:21 to 1:55:43( Edit History Discussion )

Judd Gregg: this a better country in the future. mr. gregg: the senator is absolutely correct. the money to pay interest, more than half of the interest payment will go to people in china or people in rus people in the middle eastern countries, rather than it here to build better schools

1:55:44 to 1:56:06( Edit History Discussion )

Judd Gregg: or t our national defense is adequate, which is the primary responsibility of the government to build better roads or invest in energy, that seems to be a very bad policy. mr. alexander: how much time do we have left, mr. president? the presiding officer: the

1:56:07 to 1:56:21( Edit History Discussion )

Judd Gregg: senators used 16 minutes. 44 minutes left in support of the amendment. mr. gregg: mr. president, i believ under this amendment our side wo other side would have 25 minutes. that was something that senator

1:56:22 to 1:56:42( Edit History Discussion )

Lamar Alexander: conrad and i -- so i would ask unanimous consent that we be -- have another -- how much time? five minutes on then we'll go to for 25 mr. alexander: i see the senator from north dakota here and i'm glad he's here. we were talking about senate

1:56:30 to 1:58:00( Edit History Discussion )
Speech By: Lamar Alexander

1:56:43 to 1:57:05( Edit History Discussion )

Lamar Alexander: gregg's amendment which would try to put some limit on the size of the debt and my proposal which would run -- the runaway debt point of order, which is to say not this is where we should be, but let the american people and ourselves know when we reach 90%

1:57:06 to 1:57:27( Edit History Discussion )

Lamar Alexander: of g.d.p. and we can't have a budget that does that. i know that the chairman of -- senator conrad has said in committee that he didn't think that was a very effective way to do things. but i wonder why that's true. because it seems to me that it would be extremely effective to

1:57:28 to 1:57:48( Edit History Discussion )

Lamar Alexander: shine a great, big spotlight on the united states senate and say proposed a budget that exceeds 90% of the gross domestic product of this country for a year. you can't do that bipartisan group agree to do it and i wonder,

1:57:49 to 1:58:00( Edit History Discussion )

Lamar Alexander: senator gregg, whether you believe that these kinds of limits, these kinds of spotlights wouldn't be a helpful tool in beginning to reduce the staggering debt that these

1:58:01 to 1:58:21( Edit History Discussion )

Judd Gregg: budgets propose. mr. gregg: i think they would be. because, first off, we're not bore questioning the 80 -- barring the ability to budget to the floor. any budget that anticipates the debt of the united states, which this budget would occur under this budget, which

1:58:05 to 1:59:10( Edit History Discussion )
Speech By: Judd Gregg

1:58:22 to 1:58:42( Edit History Discussion )

Judd Gregg: would occur under proposed by the president, has a general debt of over 90% of g.d.p.of the gross national product, requires 60 votes. why shouldn't it? if you're going to do that, i you're going to step on off down the road of basically of br bana

1:58:43 to 1:59:04( Edit History Discussion )

Judd Gregg: republickism, is that a term, you should have a super majority to accomplish that. i don't want to be like some of these nat listed by the senator from tennessee. i would rather not find myself in a situation where we basically can't afford our debt an passing on to our children a nation which has been spending

1:59:05 to 1:59:11( Edit History Discussion )

Judd Gregg: that it has run up a debt th makes it virtually impossible

1:59:12 to 1:59:20( Edit History Discussion )

Lamar Alexander: for our kids to live as good a life as we have. i think there shod be a 60-vote on tha mr. alexander: i ask unanimous consent to allow a couple of

1:59:15 to 1:59:20( Edit History Discussion )
Speech By: Lamar Alexander

1:59:21 to 1:59:40( Edit History Discussion )

Kent Conrad: more minutes because i see senator kyl from mr. conrad: i would yield two minutes off of my time to senator kyl. i do that not because i'm eager to hear from senator kyl on this amendment, but i would like to maintain the overall time constraint we've put in place

1:59:25 to 1:59:40( Edit History Discussion )
Speech By: Kent Conrad

1:59:41 to 2:00:01( Edit History Discussion )

Jon Kyl: given all the other so i would -- seriously, i would be happy to yield two minutes. mr. alexander: i thank the senator for his mr. kyl: i'm appreciative and is chagrined at the same i wanted to make a point i don't know if it was made before with specificity.

1:59:45 to 2:01:35( Edit History Discussion )
Speech By: Jon Kyl